another newbie -- to this therapy. at least...

I'm so pleased to have found this site -- I've been trying to work through the Feeling Good Handbook, but have been finding it tough to stick to by myself. My depression has been going on for some time, but I'll try to keep my intro as brief as I can: First went to a doctor about my low mood in 1999. I was, at that point, married and my daughters were 3 and 5. We had just moved from England to Australia for an exciting career opportunity for my husband -- our life was very good, but he still wasn't happy. My husband is a bitter, unhappy man, and was emotionally abusive towards me because of it. We'd been married for 8 years and had moved from England to Canada, back to England and then to Australia in search of a job/life in which he could be happy. I'm Canadian, and all my family is here in Toronto, so the move to Australia was a huge one for me. I guess that I had really been hanging on to the idea that everything would be ok if we could just find the right space for him, but when Australia still wasn't it I gave up hoping. I pulled myself together enough to leave him a couple of years later and moved home to Toronto with my daughters. Took a senior job with a small consulting firm, where I was promised a very short path to a leadership role. The partners announced 2 months later that they had sold the firm to a larger consulting firm. I'd been through a buy-out situation before, so wasn't really surprised when everyone went into preservation mode though, having just joined the firm, I felt more than a little isolated. I decided to weather it out partly, I guess, because I thought there was real potential in the merged firm, and partly because my salary was good, I'd just bought a house, and I wanted stability for my children. The dog-eat-dog behaviour continued, though, and sales and performance targets were being raised beyond anything remotely reasonable. I tried, I really did, but I was continually late to pick my girls up from after-school care, I was too tired to help them much with their homework, and my patchy attention was beginning to show in their behaviour and their marks. I wasn't sleeping, and tears were barely under the surface most of the time (even at work!). I talked to the partner I reported in to, but he didn't want to know anything

Hi there. Here I am.

Thanks, Kera7, for your supportive response to my intro. It's really good to know there are people who truly understand. I know that black abyss or pit of despair entirely too well -- has the medication helped you keep away from it or what do you to to pull yourself out? Kids are wonderful, aren't they? Mine are 11 and 13 now, so we're getting into some of that teenager stuff but they're caring, confident, healthy young women -- they make me laugh and I'm so proud of them. I was concerned about how all the change, unhappiness and negativity they experienced when they were younger would affect them, and it did for a while but they are happy, have close friends, are doing well at school, and make good choices in tough situations. Sending you positive energy...

so this is me.

Hi Flower Medication doesn't seem to work for me either. I've seen a couple of GPs and a psychiatrist, and they all think it's just a matter of finding the right one, but I've tried Zoloft, Paxil, Effexor and Wellbutrin now and I'm losing faith. And I hate the woozy feeling of coming on and off these drugs! I worked for awhile with a nutritionist when I was in between drugs, and I'm happy to share with you the important things I learned: - a good multi-vitamin, multi-mineral, high in the B vitamins, daily - salmon oil (or the like) for Essential Fatty Acids daily - avoid, as much as possible, simple carbohydrates (sugar, white bread, etc) and caffeine as they tend to give a rush of energy and then drop you into a pit. Too much time on this kind of roller coaster can interfere with sleep patterns as well. - protein-rich foods are important for stable energy levels, as are complex carbohydrates (whole grains, high-fibre fruit and vegetables, etc), but most important is a well-balanced diet - a deficiency in magnesium can be a contributer to depression. While I don't know how common magnesium deficiency is, the best way to boost magnesium levels is by taking a long, hot bath in magnesium sulphate (otherwise known as epsom salts, a component in many bath salts). As I'm much better at beating myself up than treating myself, I like to tell myself that I have a magnesium deficiency that needs regular treatment! - lots of water, as even mild dehydration can make you feel flat and tired. - regular exercise, even just a leisurely walk for 20 minutes a day, boosts energy and feel-good hormones. There's a ton of different advice on diet and depression, and it can take a lot of time and money to weed through it all. The vitamin stuff can be a minefield as well, because taking supplements of some vitamins can throw levels of other vitamins out of whack and it gets far too complicated for me to keep track of! There's very little hard evidence, either, so I like to keep things simple and supplement a balanced diet with the few things that most experts agree upon. Now if I could just follow my own advice, stay away from chocolate and motivate myself to exercise...! Hope this was helpful.

Relationship Goals

Taking care of yourself, as a people-pleaser, isn't selfish -- we just tend to get into relationships, romantic or otherwise, where people get used to us doing everything to please them and then reinforce our feeling of being selfish when we try to do something just for us. I try to keep the oxygen in the airplane analogy in mind: they tell you to put the oxygen mask on yourself first, then on your children or others who need help. I made a promise to myself, after my divorce and a few other experiences that made me finally realize that pleasing someone all the time isn't good for my mental or physical health over the long term (I'm a slow learner, sometimes), that I will start each new relationship as I mean to continue it. I don't know if you've got yourself into the imbalance in give/take with your fiance, Kera7, but if you have, you may want to choose as a goal one small thing that would move you toward a better balance -- "I will say no to running any errand for him that will take me more than 30 minutes out of my way." I'm making assumptions based on my experiences -- I hope I'm not too far off. You're a strong and good person -- you pulled yourself back from the brink for the sake of yourself and your children. You deserve to be respected for your feelings, whether someone agrees with or understands them or not.

depression or sick?

I've had those symptoms as well. The weak, sluggish and feeling down part is the depression, I think, but the nausea and then the hives I put down to the extreme stress. It's not uncommon to feel nauseous from stress, but I was surprised at the hives. Same as for you, littlecookie, I had just a couple here and a couple there, but I'm 44 and have never had hives before. It was as if my body was screaming at me to pay it some attention before I completely burnt out. The hives went away in a couple of weeks without me actually doing anything to alleviate the stress -- I was too far into the flaming tailspin to do anything anyway except crash and burn -- but I really do think it's the body crying for help (if allergy has been ruled out). Hope this helps.

Is Anyone Out There?

I left my husband, not because he cheated and lied, but because he was an emotionally abusive bully. I don't know which, if either, is worse, but the thing they both have in common with the "just think of all the starving children and snap out of it" people is a blatant lack of respect. Everyone deserves to be respected for who they are, their feelings and their beliefs, most particularly by people who claim they care about us! Living with, loving, someone who treats you with such disrespect is soul-destroying. I was married for 9 years, and I was so ashamed of myself for allowing him to treat me like he did. I withdrew into myself almost completely: I lost my voice, my self-esteem, my self. I really don't think that I would have had the emotional strength to leave if it hadn't been for my children. My girls were 4 and 6 when one day they were present during one of his tirades and I realized that I couldn't just stand by and allow them to grow up in that environment, to grow up thinking that the way their father behaved was an appropriate way to treat someone or to be treated. That was nearly 7 years ago. I'm back in the black hole again -- possibly because I under-estimated the damage to my self-esteem, but also because I subsequently got into a toxic work environment and then my father got ill and passed away (please, please, nobody say "what doesn't kill you makes you stronger!") -- but my girls are wonderful. They are happy and confident in themselves and I know that I made the right decision. And I can't even imagine the state I would be in now if I had been through the past few years with his criticism, ridicule and contempt along to support me! Others here have said it, but I'm going to repeat it: it's hard for people who have never experienced depression to really understand what we're going through. But for people who truly care about us, that's a cop out -- you don't need to understand in order to support someone you love.

Hello

Hi Katy -- It's good that you have some wonderful positives in your life, but it sounds as though the negatives are weighing pretty heavily. You've found a good place though -- I'm new here too, and I'm finding it helpful so hopefully you will also. What's up with your home/personal life?

Is Anyone Out There?

Thanks for the supportive words and sentiments :) It actually made me feel better just to write that post, knowing that it would be read by people who really get it. I journal, but I'm the only one who reads my rants and ravings -- not quite the same. Self-esteem or courage in my convictions, perhaps. I like myself and truly believe that I am a good, intelligent, capable person, but I don't seem to have any faith that other people will see me that way. I have a very strong inner critic who is always there, at the ready, with his "yeah, but..." whenever I congratulate myself for a job well done. It's really difficult for me to stand my ground if someone challenges a statement I've made, even if I know that I'm right, unless I have a concrete reference to back me up. And, with my memory in the state it is, accessing references is more than a little tough! :confuse: I've never been fond of conflict, but since my marriage it's almost a phobia. Even hearing my children bickering creates a tremendous amount of anxiety in me. I can usually reduce the anxiety with breathing if it's my children, but otherwise I withdraw into myself -- protecting my core, I suppose. Loud men I find especially intimidating, and I've developed an extremely irritating habit of going all girly and cute if I have to say something potentially controversial. It makes me crazy! It also takes away from any professional demeanour that I may have been trying to put across. Does this make any sense?

Why does negative self talk feel comforting?

Do you think that the negative scripts are comforting because they're familiar? I don't find the positive talk very comforting either -- I think because it's new, takes effort, and is hard to believe. I'm trying to catch my negative thoughts and replace them or argue against them, and it works sometimes but many times that very familiar voice snickers at my "rationalization" or says "yeah, so that may be true, but what about...?" and any good feeling that I may have started to generate is drowned in the waves of guilt or shame. Much easier just to float in the familiar guilt and shame right from the start, but I know that to succumb to the negative stuff is just going to keep me in this pit. I don't know about you, but I'm finding this CBT to be really hard. I don't want to examine my thoughts and emotions -- it makes me feel awful to bring the fact that I'm depressed and not coping right out in the open, if that makes any sense :) And it's hard to find the time to do all the homework. But I can't stay where I am, as comfortable as it may be, because I have my wonderful children to support.

Ready to Give Up

Hi Lady I feel your frustration! The ads on tv say "You don't have to go through this alone. Talk to your doctor." I resisted for a long time, because I don't like taking medication, but my "not coping" was getting so out of control that I finally went to my doctor, truly thinking that the medication would make me feel better. My doctor didn't suggest any therapy, just medication. First was Zoloft, and she kept increasing my dose until we reached the maximum and she decided that a different drug would work better. Same with Paxil, then Effexor, then Wellbutrin... I hate coming off one and going on another, and I'm sick and tired of feeling this way! And if it's not working, why on earth am I filling my body with heavy duty drugs? Research shows over and over that a combination of medication and therapy is the most effective treatment for depression, and one would think that there would be some sort of communication between the therapist and the prescribing doctor (ideally, they would be the same person, but I haven't been able to find anyone like that). I'd ask your doctor why he doesn't want to speak with your therapist -- if he doesn't think she adds value, then ask him which therapy/therapist he would recommend. I'm figuring out that medication doesn't help everyone, and I think I get what you mean about not wanting the problem to be you -- if medication worked for me, then my depression was simply due to a chemical imbalance and could be classified as an "acceptable" disease like, say diabetes. Having tried a few different medications with no luck, I need to accept that it's not a chemical imbalance and must therefore be "in my head". Less tangible, less acceptable, makes people look at me sideways when I tell them. So I don't tell them, and I hide myself away so they won't see and judge me. Am I just weird, or does that resonate? I don't know what I'm going to do about my medication, but I'll pre-empt Josie and Danielle and confirm that I won't make any changes without talking to my doctor first. You sound sensible enough to do the same. You also sound strong and determined -- you'll make it through this. Sending you healing energy, Janice