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9 years ago 0 +0 / -0 219

Good to see you back Coinman,

Holidays are difficult for lots of people for different reasons. This was my first holiday season to get through with panic attacks and agoraphobia as I was just diagnosed in June. I was very concerned about being around a large amount of family. But each time the thought occurred I sent it to the corner. I had to pull positives from my CBT. It worked. At one point there were over 30 family members gathered in a small space and more noise pollution than I care for. I went outside for a brief minute because of the heat but not because of fight or flight. At that moment, I realized oven, furnace, overcrowded, for goodness sake, shut the heat off and turn on the central air. It was an automatic response. CBT did this for me.

Looking forward to hearing about your successes as you work through the program.

9 years ago 0 +0 / -0 6252

Did it heal. I don't know anything about it but could see where scarring could impede performance. Some days having Arthritis on top of being older and slower tries my positive thinking. It always passes. It is especially hard having friends ten years older than me with nothing wrong with them. Things could be worse, I have 17 scars from operations and I too should not be here but I am. My brother has two, but both are from Cancer. Death comes to all and I hope before it does that I have done some good and not wasted this reprieve.

I keep flogging CBT but by now you must realize it is just a tool. A person must be able to think and act positive in a sea of negative to use it. Knowing how the brain works is knowing why is all. Knowing why gives reason to doing it though. But it still is a case of what you get out of it is what you put into it. One of the hardest things is seeing the negative for what it is and ignoring it so it doesn't get into memory. Just because it shows up once in a while doesn't mean you are doing anything wrong. The number of stressors has increased ten fold in less years. It just means we have to work harder and find more relaxing things to do, and the time to do them. Something that is not always easy to do.

But for those of us who were really messed up anything is better than that and proof that it can still get better.

Davit

9 years ago 0 +0 / -0 8

Thanks again for all the positive advice! Sorry I have been away from the computer for the last couple of days as this time of year is very difficult for me for several reasons and more recently with a new wife and children “try” my best not to think about the past. However I do understand and with your and this websites help, I must deal with it and move forward!

First off, I shouldn’t even be alive right now at age 50 as I have had a serious VSD since birth. All through school I had to spend my holiday season in the hospital on Christmas break getting tested via cardiac cats (a big deal back then), etc so as not to have to take days off from normal school attendance or family summer vacation time.

Add to that my father died on Christmas Eve 1996 virtually drowning in and pucking up his own blood from esophagus cancer as it grew into a main artery while at home. He fought a mighty battle with it for years with Chemo and surgeries but lost. Turned out the cancer was stronger than the strongest man I ever knew was! My dad!!!

I have to remind myself of the “positives” and think this will be a good aspect of venturing on with this program if I can just let this all sink into my brain and let the past go!!! In other words, being lucky to even be alive doesn’t mean one has to crawls up in a “safe zone corner” like I have done for years now. In fact one of my most exhilarating and proudest moments recently was a trip to the dentist (my worst fear) about 8 months ago to get some teeth pulled. I imagined the worst like back when I was 16 (34 years ago) getting my impacted bottom wisdom teeth pulled and the excruciating pain afterwards and the intense fear as I knew I needed a couple more molars pulled recently. Panic attack 101!!! Then after it was done a few months ago absolutely no pain other that a little prick from a local anesthetic. I was so elevated after I left the dentist office, I was ecstatic! And couldn’t even answer myself “why” did I put up with these three teeth hurting so badly I couldn’t hardly eat for the past 5+ years???

As mentioned by JayDee & Davit, it is all about the brains ways of “prioritizing[DK1] ”! Negative thoughts based on past experiences are priority over positive ones subconsciously. For me at least, this is the “trigger” of full blown uncontrollable panic attacks then avoidance!

Again I look forward to the next session of “Exposure Work”. I honestly didn’t want to start this via such a “negative time of year” but now that it is over, looking very forward to moving on with this program!!!!

[DK1]

9 years ago 0 +0 / -0 219

I'm glad Davit answered and mentioned the destructive core belief in the last part of your message because I noticed that right off.

Might I suggest you change it to "I am a willing and good provider for my family." Repeat this positive statement over and over with good feelings.

Recall my side note to my last response? Conflict and resentment is a burden to hold onto. Let go of it.

9 years ago 0 +0 / -0 6252

My brother is a type A. He takes three or four blood pressure medications. He is almost impossible to do anything with. The difference is that he has no intention of changing. In fact I don't know if he even realizes he is like that.

You have to want to change before you can. You know the saying, don't bring the job home.

If you are type A then separate it. I have a millionaire neighbour who can do this. It isn't that hard. It just means having split pathways in memory. Business goes down one and pleasure the other. This is controlled by long term memory and is set up by repetition. It means forcing yourself to never be type A around family till it is established. No different than any other situation. A situation triggers a question and long term memory answers the question with this is either business or pleasure and that sets the pathway the situation will use. Very little to change except adding the one control to split the reaction.

There is a destructive core belief in the last sentence of your post. You need to be a dollar provider but there is no reason you can not be a man of respect doing it. Money is a necessity but happiness lies elsewhere. This is a very hard thing to accept. Pride and happiness are a state of mind. Anyone can be happy, rich or poor. Money certainly makes it easier, but focussing on it makes it harder.

You can flip over what if's to make positive ones. As for helping people, it is hard to do without seeming to be taking over. It is hard to offer help or advice without adding in "you should" All I want to do is offer my experience and information, whether people use it should be up to them. Even if I think they should.

I should mention here that you are doing very well in my opinion because changing thought patterns can be very hard. In fact to the point that people give up because they don't understand that it is just time and repetition that make the changes and they don't realize that the changes will be permanent.

Davit

9 years ago 0 +0 / -0 8

Thanks all for your help and “caring”. As I was unsure of what a “type A” personality meant, I went ahead and took an online cognitive “test”. The results are shown below: Your interactions with others and your day-to-day existence are heavily tinged with impatience and hostility. When you're stressed or frustrated, you may lash out at others or end up stewing in anger or frustration. Your elevated score may put you at risk because a high amount of this aspect of the TABP can not only be extremely harmful to relationships, it is also very damaging to your health. While originally it was thought that global Type A Behavior Pattern was the culprit in coronary heart disease, research now shows that hostility, impatience and the other related traits are likely the real source of the problem. Based on your results here, you may be at an increased risk of heart disease. Keep in mind however, that there are other causes unrelated to the TABP, such as poor diet, lack of exercise, and smoking, among other things.

All in all, I answered the 50+ questions as honestly as I could. In all, I cant disagree with anything said above other than I do desire to be helpful to others. Perhaps a control issue? And then NOT when fully in control via any issue or circumstance the "Panic" sets up and in again and again! The "what if's" simply take over and rule!!!

Simply put, I am an over thinker and while that serves well in business, does not do sell well when it comes to family and friends. As advised, not only do I look froward to the next section but will do so as advised in gradual exposure therapy.

Honestly am very much looking forward to being a man of respect like I was once instead of just a meal ticket $$$ provider like I am now... Thanks again... David

9 years ago 0 +0 / -0 219

David,

During one of my exposure sessions I was thrown "off the deep end" into exposure. It did not work out for me. It was traumatizing and I had a major setback. I'm going to have to agree with Davit on this one. If you're a type "A" person this might work for you. I'm not a type "A" person, so it doesn't work for me. I have to take the slow gradual path with exposure therapy.

A side note: "off the deep end" exposure not only caused a major setback it also caused conflicts with others as I harbored resentment towards them over my own failings.

9 years ago 0 +0 / -0 6252

Hi David

I see you have found the "off the deep end" exposure on the internet. This is in my opinion only workable if you are a type "A" get out of my face type of person. You can beat it into submission but it will still be there. And in so doing you can I suppose create a new pathway in memory saying this one has no power. But you have to do that with all your exposures then. The other way you are not dealing with the exposure but how you see the exposure. In this the trigger (exposure) gets an attitude reaction more gentle and less likely to set off panic. Basically it is saying this is not important instead of this is something I have to deal with. And there you have that "have to" which is negative.

The ten questions is designed to decide for each exposure if it is important (some are) and give you a way to deal with them so you have control not the exposure. Off the deep end always starts with the exposure having control and you have to take it back. If the exposure has little or no importance then you already have control.

I prefer the gentler way even though I know both work. After all at the end of the day the more positives verses negatives you deal with the less chance of panic and the less chance you will need help to deal with it, like pills, booze or whatever you normally would use.

The choice is yours, you could try both ways. A small aside is that if you do develop an attitude to exposure that it has little control people will have less edge in their dealings with you since you will already have control with out showing it.

Dealing with family friends and associates will be smoother too if every exposure doesn't leave you rigid.

It all comes back to what do you want in memory and how do you want it influencing your actions. Remember everything is connected so it will do this. CBT is not about changing surroundings, people or triggers, it is about how you see them (cognitive) and what your reaction is (behavioural). Therapy is you doing it.

Davit

9 years ago 0 +0 / -0 11215

Welcome Coinman,

Congrats on all the hard work you have already put in. Slowing down on the next few sessions is a good idea. CBT does take quite a bit of time and practice. It takes systematic, daily effort to change thought patterns. But once you have the new pattern engrained it becomes much easier. Think of it as forming new neural pathways. When you plan to create a pathway it takes quite a bit of work. You have to figure out where you want the pathway to go, get all the junk out of the pathway and then walk down it over and over again. The first few times might be confusing but after a while the grass gets padded down and the sticks get pushed out of the way - soon your pathway is easy to walk through and it doesn't take much thought.

You are right. There are two ways considered in exposure therapy. There is gradual exposure which this program is based on. There is also "flooding" which many people find can be re traumatising.

Keep us updated on how you are doing.

Ashley, Health Educator

Here to help :)

9 years ago 0 +0 / -0 8

Davit & JayDee,

Thank you both VERY MUCH again for your well placed advice! Sorry if I blew through the first couple of steps/ sections via this program rather fast as most I already knew because of similar “buttered” programs I have tried in the past. Believe me, when it comes to the end of section 3 starting on section 4, a HUGE slowdown will be realized! Section 4 dealing with “Exposure Work”, I will have to take in baby steps!!! But will continue via very hard work but at the same time not doing so much so quickly the results will only add to or reinforce the negativity already well implanted in my mind! If I may ask, as I have read conflicting theories, is Blast in your face exposure therapy confronting what one is the most afraid of in your opinions “the way to go” or a more subtle approach gradually realizing ones fears are not realistic or unfounded the better way? Perhaps level 4 will answer this but just asking your “personal” opinion first. Thanks… David

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