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Classification of Alcoholics By Dr William D Silkworth:


10 years ago 0 77 logo logo logo logo logo logo logo logo logo logo 0
 
Hi
I definitely agree that the most important thing is to be aware there are choices. Until I came to this website I thought AA was the only way. I suspect there are many people who think that if AA doesn't work than it is hopeless.
 
I'm sure AA is the right choice for a vast number of people but not for me. I suppose that is ironic as I am a committed Christian and have been all my life.
God Bless
 
10 years ago 0 557 logo logo logo logo logo logo logo logo logo logo 0
There is some truth in what you are both saying. Everyone is different and we have to find what will help us, whether it is through spirituality, exercise, self-discipline, etc. I think the important is to keep looking and try.
10 years ago 0 1009 logo logo logo logo logo logo logo logo logo logo 0

"bedevilments"......"Thy will be done."........."When these crop up, we ask God at once to remove them......" .....a "Big Book"........a prophet in Bill W..........12 Steps (kind of like 10 commandments)........"Made a decision to turn our will and our lives over to the care of God as we understood Him".........."Were entirely ready to have God remove all these defects of character"....."Humbly asked Him to remove our shortcomings."........

How quasi-religious.......everyone is entitled to make their own decisions about how they want to pursue a "religious" recovery (because AA is directly based on the teachings of a Christian fundamentalist sect called "The Oxford Group" so it IS religion based), and if that floats your boat go for it. Be very opened minded though and research BOTH sides of the topic. It is very important to do this at the front end of your recovery process, just like one should research any type solution that will potentially help (AVRT, SMART Recovery, etc). Find what works for you. At the end of the day we all make the choice to drink and there are plenty of options to choose from for getting past it. 

Best regards,

Dave

10 years ago 0 1562 logo logo logo logo logo logo logo logo logo logo 0
Spiritual Malady:

The book describes it as a state of being restless, irritable and discontented unless we can again experience the sense of ease and comfort which comes at once by taking a few drinks-drinks which they see others taking with impunity. 

Additionaly the bedevilments: Having trouble with personal relationships, couldn't control our emotional natures, we were a prey to misery and depression, we couldn't make a living, we had a feeling of uselessness, we were full of fear, we were unhappy, we couldn't seem to be of real help to other people. 

10 years ago 0 1562 logo logo logo logo logo logo logo logo logo logo 0
Unfortunately, A.A. does not encourage healing through self introspection, but rather allow "a power greater than ourselves" to do it for you.

Absolutely not my experience. If you read the book Alcoholics Anonymous, once you accept the powerlessness, we are asked to be rigorously honest about rest of the steps. After a thorgough self apprisal and sharing the shortcomings with another person, which I believe is introspection, the book says:

We vigorously commenced this way of living as we cleaned up the past. We have entered the world of the Spirit. Our next function is to grow in understanding and effectiveness. This is not an overnight matter. It should continue for our lifetime. Continue to watch for selfishness, dishonesty, resentment, and fear. When these crop up, we ask God at once to remove them. We discuss them with someone immediately and make amends quickly if we have harmed anyone. Then we resolutely turn our thoughts to someone we can help. Love and tolerance of others is our code.

I believe this is also introspection. The program is all about empowering members to live a peaceful serene life. 
10 years ago 0 1562 logo logo logo logo logo logo logo logo logo logo 0
My experience after some AA meetings was actually a desire to drink and many times I did drink straight after.

Its a misconception in the fellowship that just going to meetings will keep the member sober. Unfortunately thats not the case. The first step of recovery starts within, admitting that we can't touch alcohol anymore and then comes the rest of the AAs 12 steps. The reminder of the steps is about changing the old way of thinking and directing our attention on being of little help to others. Its a program designed for living, it does not even talk about being sober after the first 45 pages of the book. 

As we go through the day we pause, when agitated or doubtful, and ask for the right thought or action. We constantly remind ourselves we are no longer running the show, humbly saying to ourselves many times each day "Thy will be done." We are then in much less danger of excitement, fear, anger, worry, self-pity, or foolish decisions. We become much more efficient. We do not tire so easily, for we are not burning up energy foolishly as we did when we were trying to arrange life to suit ourselves.
10 years ago 0 1562 logo logo logo logo logo logo logo logo logo logo 0
I do not believe AA can help you unless you really want to help yourself.

Amen. Unfortunately, people are forced into AA by judicial system and by their loved ones. if the individuals are not ready, nothing will work. Already something has happened to your friend, he is jail now. Hope he will be more willing to look at options out there in the world.
10 years ago 0 557 logo logo logo logo logo logo logo logo logo logo 0
Thank you all for sharing your thoughts. I do not believe AA can help you unless you really want to help yourself. My friend has been to so many AA meetings, he knows it by heart. I think something has to happen. My first boyfriend, when I was 15, was a drug addict and an alcoholic. He was 17. Eventually I left him. He finally stopped drinking and consuming when he was 50. He told me, one day he was lying in bed in another rehab and he saw a big box and when he opened it, thousands of butterfly came out and he never had the feelings to drink after. Strange, maybe spiritual. The sad thing he died 4 years after from alcohol related cancer. I did recognize foxman definition of my last friend. I think it is because he still have that urge to drink. The only reason he stops is because he is scared of something whether it is jail, dying from pills, being homeless, whatever. I got really scared because I am so sure he is not stopping because he wants to. When I quit smoking, I was so decided, I rarely thought about smoking. I really wanted to stop. Ask me to stop now, after being smoke free for 16 years and I just can't find the reason why I should. I guess it is the same with alcohol. You need to find your real reason, deep inside and until you do, I think there is no hope. I have all those idea why but I guess I have not find the right one yet :_) Thank you for your answers
10 years ago 0 77 logo logo logo logo logo logo logo logo logo logo 0
I had to get off that ride. I had to make a firm conscious decision not to drink again. I had to get control over my AV, learn that it is alive and well in my brain and that the 'ME' voice can control it . I learned it at the rational recovery website and it is the best thing that every happened to me. I am 62 days alcohol free and I have my life back.
God bless
 
10 years ago 0 77 logo logo logo logo logo logo logo logo logo logo 0
Hi
 
I have been reading the posts for a few days and decided it's time to put my 2 eggs in :)
 
I don't like to speak about things that I may not fully understand or run the risk of influencing anyone to take or not take any particular path toward abstinence. So I can only speak from my own experience.
 
I've been drinking alcoholically which I define as 'uncontrolled' drinking for several years. Thinking that I could have one and than bingeing for weeks at a time. Craving the 'drunk' feeling and giving in to that despite the knowledge that it would end in disaster. Again, that is just my experience and opinion. The drinking progressively got worse and in the last year I nearly lost it all. I relapsed many times. For the last 4 years I have desperately tried to stop.
 
I started attending AA meetings and was a regular attendee. I was the coffee/tea lady. Some weeks when things were very tough, I went to an AA meeting every night. I enjoyed being with the people who were very kind and open. I did not find them particularly helpful in the actual steps that I needed to take to stop, ie: I could not get a sponsor. I work full time and was caring for my husband who is completely immobile at home so truthfully, it was hard to work out a time that was convenient. The ladies who I chose that I could relate to also worked full time and had family responsibilities. I own a big book, read it regularly as well as many other books that are recommended by AA.
 
My experience after some AA meetings was actually a desire to drink and many times I did drink straight after. I found it very upsetting to hear the 'shares' about how individuals lives were completely changed and so happy without alcohol, new job, new car, new house, new man/woman. The one thing that I wanted from life was my relationship with my husband back, and not drinking wasn't going to restore it so I felt what is the point. I was angry because despite being a Christian all of my life and praying to God every day to deliver me I couldn't stop. During some 'shares' people who never believed in God, suddenly were delivered by God, free'd from this horrible evil thing, but God wouldn't help me. I also would say to myself before buying my bottle 'well, I'm sick, I'm an alcoholic, I can't help it'. I was scared because I couldn't get to 7 meetings a week, and if I couldn't get to a meeting I couldn't be cured. If I didn't get a sponsor I was never going to be well. I tried to live by 'one day at a time' but it meant that I had to decide not to drink every morning, instead of deciding not to drink again, ever.  I am not saying this is 'reasonable' or 'rational' thinking, perhaps it isn't, but it is how my brain works.
 
I've come to discover that God helps those who help themselves, something my mother used to tell me. I still love God and pray every day and I believe that He does help me but, I couldn't put it entirely on His doorstep or make it any other spiritual beings job to keep me away from the bottle. I had to take responsibility for my actions and I did not feel that AA helped me to do that. I am not trying to put it down at all, I believe it probably does work for many people. It just didn't for me.
 
I started with the thing that makes me drink, depression. I tackled that first and not wanting a drink seemed to follow.
I still suffer from depression and perhaps always will, but I recognize that it is a major factor in my wanting to drink. It's a vicious circle, I'm sad, life stinks, drinking gives me an escape, I get drunk, life still stinks when I 'come to', I'm sadder and now I'm humiliated, embarresed and ashamed because I can't control my drinking, ...and on and on it goes.
 

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