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Is it CBT

10 years ago 0 +0 / -0 177

Davit,

Yeah I guess it does. I've heard of others with emetophobia who won't take any medication with nausea as a possible side effect, which would be pretty much all of them. It does scare me, but I'll take them anyway, like my Zoloft. Did you know that emetophobia is the 5th most common phobia? There's even a support group forum, but they don't have a treatment plan like this site.

It's normal though, to avoid the foods that cause heartburn. I tend to get indigestion a lot, especially if I eat too quickly, but I manage it by drinking more water. Sometimes it hurts, and my anxiety levels go through the roof, but mostly it's okay. That's interesting that having your spleen removed would have that effect.

Usually I only vomit once every 3 years or so. But in the past couple of years, it's been on 8 different occasions, which didn't help my anxiety at all. The worst was 5 days after I was discharged from hospital last year. I got a vomiting virus from my younger cousins and spent almost the entire night being sick. Just after we'd finished eating dinner, I started to feel nauseous and my stomach hurt so badly. Mum told me to go for my shower, and when I got out I started freaking out. She kept asking if I was okay and I just wanted to get out of there so I went into my bedroom. No sooner had I sat on my bed, the retching started and my whole floor was covered in pretty much my entire undigested stomach contents. Not nice. I went to sleep but woke up a few hours later and started again. Then my psychologist had the hide to get up me for losing weight saying that "even bulimics can vomit and not lose weight, you just haven't been trying hard enough." She also later said that I did have bulimia, which of course I do not.

I'm thinking that it might help. Obviously, no one would volunteer to vomit continuously for however long it takes for my fear level to decrease. It's not meant to be a pleasant experience, but it is something everyone has to do. That's why watching videos and listening to audios are the way to go. I'd love to someday be able to not worry about vomiting at all unless I'm in that situation. I'm sure people who are afraid of spiders or snakes don't spend every moment worrying there may be a spider around the corner.

There is someone in Brisbane who did his PhD in the treatment of emetophobia through Griffith University (my dream uni). I missed the trial of his online treatment program since I only heard about it after it'd finished, but he's since commercialised it (it costs over $200). He did say in an email however, he would be happy to bulk bill me if I see him in his practice about an hour and half's drive away. At the time, my agoraphobia was quite bad, but now I'm improving in that sense, I might be able to. There's also another program which is slightly cheaper (google "Emetophobia Recovery System"). I'm interested in a second opinion on that program, it sounds great, but what do you think?

Thank you.
Kaitie.

10 years ago 0 +0 / -0 6252

Kaitie

Wow, with a childhood experience like that the fear makes perfect sense. A few times I have been given medications that don't go together so I have a fear there but in my case it is just a matter of looking them up in the interactions checker. I have to realize also that I might not get any of the predicted reactions. But this is not the same is it.

I know that in a few people anxiety can stop digestion completely and the stomach is not designed to be just a bag.

I had all my teeth removed to get rid of the mercury fillings for my Arthritis and have plastic teeth now. It helped a lot but now some foods like long grain rice give me reflux and pain. I avoid the foods that bother me but pepto bismol is my friend when I forget. I don't know when it started but I don't vomit, I think it was when I lost my spleen over thirty years ago. Since then I have vomited once only and that was last year from food poisoning. You can imagine the pain of needing to but not allowing myself to. I've even told myself just do it and get it over with. It isn't a big deal for me so I never looked for the association so I could cure it. But I can't vomit, retch and swallow is all.

There is probably a phobia for everything, so nothing should ever be dismissed especially by professionals. I'm disappointed.

This desensitization is much like off the deep end exposure, it doesn't always work for everyone. But if it does or if it works with CBT why not. Who knows what reaction it can trigger in your brain. CBT needs relaxation and coping skills to work properly, maybe you need desensitization. Maybe others do too.

Keep in touch, I'm learning stuff here.

Davit

10 years ago 0 +0 / -0 177

Davit,

I don't think it's staph, or at least I hope not! I'm thinking along the lines of fluid retention or a bruise. Maybe I bumped it without realising. There isn't any pus thank goodness.

Oh definitely, my first psychologist (the one I had for 5 years) totally dismissed the emetophobia. She'd never heard of it, therefore it didn't exist in her mind.

Even in the womb, I was allergic to milk. Mum was told to drink milkshakes when she was pregnant for calcium, and whenever she had one she felt nauseous. My very first feed was vomited straight back up. I was 3 when we found out I was allergic to milk protein, but I've since grown out of it. Apparently, a doctor once changed my formula and it put me in a coma because I vomited so much, I've thrown up blood and almost all my stomach lining. My Mum told me that at 9 months old, I discovered the link between eating and vomiting, and whenever she tried to any food near my mouth I clenched it shut. Obviously, I don't remember these things directly, but I've been told about them. I guess every time I have vomited since, it's like I'm re-traumatising myself and reinforcing my fear.

You're one very lucky unlucky man Davit! It's so true that when you're so sick, you don't actually feel any fear. That's how those who start fighting keep going, like you did. I'm surprised you don't have a book written about you or something!

That's something so many people have asked me, but not a question I have ever been able to answer. Yes, it's terribly embarrassing, and I'm worried that it might mean something is seriously wrong, or that it'll go on forever. But to me, vomiting is the worst case scenario if that makes sense. Like the actual experience, the retching and painful stomach contractions, the burning acidity and smell of the vomit, the sound of the retching and the subsequent splash in the toilet.

I might have to do some more research into desensitisation, and ask my psychologist. All this thinking is hurting my brain haha.

Kaitie.

10 years ago 0 +0 / -0 6252

Kaitie

What is the possibility that there is a hidden fear and not the actual fear that causes the panic? What if the fear is of the consequences if it actually happens? Like the consequences after vomiting in the lab, real or imagined. What if this fear is a missing trigger that needs to be dealt with. "We just don't do this in our family" is a powerful builder of core beliefs.

Having rules that aren't your rules is another.

Just things to think about. Having not experienced what you are experiencing has left me somewhat in the dark.

I think desensitization has more to do with a persons personality than the number of times you do it. It may not work for every one.

Davit

10 years ago 0 +0 / -0 6252

Kaitie

Staph infection is the most common infection that I know of. One thing different with it from other infections is that it can heal and look normal but form a pocket. The area gets red and itches, scratching opens it again which is a good thing because you want it to drain instead of getting in your blood. If you decide to open it use something sterile. The pus will be a light yellow and there may be some blood. You can treat it like a boil which is actually a Staph infection too. Here is hoping it isn't staph.

People probably say that is weird and shrug off you phobia because they can't understand the effect it has. I can understand an association building if you have been studying worst case scenarios. As you would have to if you are going to be a Doctor. This on top of an actual experience would build a core belief that it has to happen. A tough one for sure. I'm presuming you have had an actual experience and this is why the fear of it happening again. If not it would be easier to say, not me. Especially if it was only visualized.

Doctors are human too, which is why they don't want to see you after the operation. To have some one die on the table is one thing, to watch them die after is another. Last year I had a very bad infection, so bad they went back in and cut out inches of muscle and tissue and threw it away. What a mess. The incision bubbled green for weeks and I was on four antibiotics for months. What kept me alive was the look on the Doctors face. He knew he was going to lose me. I think that is the hardest part for a Doctor and I don't blame him for checking on me through the nurses. When I turned around he said I had a long road ahead and was very lucky. He said I nearly died three times.

It should have been one long panic attack but wasn't because till I turned it was one huge constant distraction. After was a different storey. Once I was going to live I had lots to panic about.

When I was a school kid in grade five I think we used to have to stand in line in our out door cloths in the hall and sing before going to class. I'd get hot and claustrophobic and have to run to the bathroom and vomit. Some times I didn't make it. I have no idea why it never formed a phobia. Same with the bed pan. Mostly what I felt was anger and anger can be a coping skill.

Davit

10 years ago 0 +0 / -0 177

Hi Davit,

My finger is still swollen, a day later, and slightly red. It's in the middle joint and down to the base. I wrapped it in a bandage last night, because I couldn't stop scratching the swollen area. Definitely not arthritis it appears. I had a scratch right where it's swollen, I can't remember what from but I know it was a couple of weeks ago. The scratch itself has totally healed, you can see the mark but the skin's closed over. That's why I thought it was itchy. It's totally weird, hopefully it'll go down in a couple of days and I won't need antibiotics or anything.

I've had so many needles, I lost count years ago. It's not actually the needles that scare me. In blood tests, I ask to lay down because I'm worried if I see the blood I'll faint. If it's an immunisation, I worry I'll get sick from whatever's in the injection (even so, I'm still totally up-to-date with my vaccinations). The main source of everything is the fear of vomiting.

Where don't my triggers come from? Haha. Every decision I have ever made has been based on my emetophobia, whether is be going with it or against it. I actually cannot remember a time when I wasn't afraid of vomiting. I can certainly use CBT to help me deal with the avoidance of places and situations in which I may vomit, as I have been. Both the triggers you mentioned (experienced or imagined) are relevant for me. I chose not defer my uni studies because I knew I would have to work in the same science lab I threw up in last year. I can also envision myself throwing up at different places, even if I never have. I even have nightmares about vomiting (different each time) and wake up in a panic. Last year that happened most nights for months on end.

Another thing is, I'm afraid of having diarrhoea too. I've had it less than 5 times in my whole life, but its connection to vomiting scares me.

I have heard of a technique called "desensitisation" which is used to treat emetophobia and BII phobia, but I've never used it myself or had anyone to do it with. Basically, it involves looking at pictures, watching videos, listening to audios and using your imagination to expose yourself to it. As with any exposure, you have to do it until your fear levels decrease enough that there is a noticeable difference. The idea is that eventually, when exposed to the situation, you can kind of "switch off". It reminds me of how if a surgeon sees their patient as a person and thinks about how upset their relatives and friends would be if they didn't survive, that surgeon wouldn't be able to operate at all. They can only do their job if they can focus on the procedure and think of the patient as a group of organs while they're operating. They're able to just switch off their emotions, and I love how they can do that.

Kaitie.

10 years ago 0 +0 / -0 6252

Kaitie

About the needle thing, there are two kinds of triggers that can happen from a phobia, one is from experience and the other is from imagination from seen but not experienced as in a movie or conversation with someone else's experience. Because getting, giving or watching are all voluntary, CBT would work.

CBT can't prevent vomiting once the action starts but if the trigger is voluntary rather than involuntary as in an actual reason such as nausea. CBT would work. Is it possible that the trigger triggers something that triggers the urge which causes the fear. In a round about rather than direct route. This would be harder to deal with. Like not dealing with a step because it doesn't appear to be there. In which case the only thing left is coping skills. Which although not CBT are at least close.

Davit

10 years ago 0 +0 / -0 6252

Kaitie

Arthritis is joint specific. Starting from your nails the first joint is ostio the next two are Rheumatoid and yes you can have both. I shared a room in hospital with a woman who had Bird Fanciers Lung, she nearly died. She can't have birds any more.

How many needles have you had, see I have had so many they don't bother me, I can do my own. My veins are so scarred that It can be painful for me especially if the needle passes through the vein.

I really have to be honest in thinking CBT might not be the answer directly for the vomit phobia since vomiting is an involuntary action like breathing, it might not pass through the triangle in the same way. It still has too but I feel there may not be an option between point two and three. When a person vomits they can't not. They can stop the trigger but not the action. Do you have any Idea where the trigger comes from. That I feel may be a key.

If all your phobias were to fall under the Agoraphobia umbrella then you only have to do one and the others fall in line.

Otherwise I would think do one at a time to avoid confusion.

I can ask my Therapist what she thinks, she is a smart lady.

Davit

10 years ago 0 +0 / -0 177

Davit,

This is something I have considered too. In the past, before finding this site, all I found in my research were rather expensive books.

I found one which helps with the treatment of emetophobia (fear of vomiting), and it isn't based on CBT. I'm interested in what techniques they use, since my fear formed even before I was capable of thinking logically and therefore isn't rational at all. I think it might also help with my Blood Injury Injection phobia. Neither of these conditions I feel would benefit as much from CBT as my Panic Disorder does. I guess it's the same as in the actual cycle (trigger, thought, response) but any attempts at trying to break it down and come back with a rational challenge statement in the past hasn't been all too helpful.

I'm wondering if it's best to treat all these individually despite them all being intertwined?

Kaitie.

P.S. Davit, with your arthritis, do you find your joints will swell in cold weather? My finger was sore last night, and I woke up this morning and the knuckle is swollen to twice its size. It hasn't gone down at all yet and it's mid afternoon. Does it sound like osteoarthritis (I am at risk), or could it be because of the scratch from my bird (which is well over a week old)?

10 years ago 0 +0 / -0 6252

Second last line, is supposed to be changing, I forgot the "c"

A note on CBT. because it involves changing a life time of thinking it is not easy to do. Because core beliefs are strong it is not easy to do. Because you are used to doing things by yourself it is not easy to do.

This is why the program is step by step to take you through it and keep you on track so there is less pain and frustration.

CBT is probably new to you and will take some adjusting too, but it works, it is the only thing that works long term because it changes how you think and prepares you to handle any trigger no matter what it is, old or new. And there will be new ones.

Davit

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